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 Post subject: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:29 am 
Woodpecker
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GW2 comes out on AUGUST 28. As the game closer to its release, I think we should talk more about forming a guild (i have no power to make it official).

So I have a few questions that I would like answered:

Who's playing?
What profession/race/build, is your main?
What do you like/hate the most about the game?
Are we going to have an official guild?
WoW & TF2 has its own section on the forums. Is GW2 gunna have one?
What sever to pick? Brolis Pass

Here's some links that you guys should visit.

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL ... ature=plcp
It's an unfinished lore summary of GW1 up to GW2.

http://en.gw2codex.com/
It's a cool website to make your builds on.

http://www.twitch.tv/guildwars2/b/324689481
It's a video called "Bringing the RPG to MMORPGs" explaining GW2's end game. (but you HAVE TO SKIP to 4:50)


Last edited by Frozen Branch on Thu Sep 06, 2012 1:13 am, edited 4 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:32 am 
Woodpecker
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Ima be playing a sylvari necromancer with the build: http://en.gw2codex.com/build/7988/show & the thing i dont like most about this game is its sluggish running speed.


Last edited by Frozen Branch on Tue Jul 31, 2012 10:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:17 pm 
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There used to be a GW1 section on the forum, I believe. So it'll probably return.

Doesn't anyone want to buy my account though? Cheap! You just have to log in as me forever, haha.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 1:30 pm 
Woodpecker
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gel wrote:
Doesn't anyone want to buy my account though? Cheap! You just have to log in as me forever, haha.

what WHY!? what do you not like about the game? Maybe i could use my awesome skills to convince you to keep it.


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:54 am 
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Already said above, but

Terrible old school target-based cooldown-ridden combat
Thin quest system
Dynamic events that aren't so dynamic and all they do is loop
TERRIBLE combat based around no skills that babies can all play
Archaic quest system disguised as a new system but is ultimately the same as most MMOs
SUPER TERRIBAD spammy APM based combat where dodging is just another roll of the RNG
everyone is 9 heads tall including children


Secret World is better than this and it has mostly archaic combat too. At least it tries something new. Nothing new in GW2.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 4:18 am 
Woodpecker
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Hope my perspective of your cons will change your mind, and sorry about the length. I just came out of essay writing mode.

gel wrote:
Terrible old school target-based cooldown-ridden combat
TERRIBLE combat based around no skills that babies can all play
SUPER TERRIBAD spammy APM based combat where dodging is just another roll of the RNG

Hmmmm, i dont see this game as a target based game. I see it as a position based game. Id consider gw1 target based. For example, In gw1 i could be looking any direction, use any skill and it would hit my target as long as they were in range. If my target was out of range, the skill would quickly reset and the game will tell me that your target is out of range. In gw2, its all about positioning (where you are standing relative to everybody else, teammates and enemies alike, will decide the out come of battles). For your spammable skill 1 attack, you have to at least be looking at your target's general direction to hit him, otherwise your attacks will be all over the place (i have accidentally aggroed many passive NPCs). If you take a look at all the non-slot-1 weapon skills for any profession, they are always about positioning (it will either set an AOE on the ground, hit in a radius around you, or have some kind movement aspect). If you use any skills out of position/range your skill will still activate (with exception of choosing an AOE out of range), and you would just be wasting it. I suppose position based combat is a flavor thing, but i have to disagree and agree with you on two things. I disagree about what you said about dodging. With NPCs, they typical give you a cue to dodge out of the way of a big attack. With pvp and bosses (so far), it means get out of the AOEs. A good player will dodge out of large attacks, a bad one will use it to run away. What i have agree with you on is the stupidity of only having a cool down being the only source of restriction when reusing a skills. This encourages people to stop thinking and start spamming (which really annoyed me). In the beta it felt like i was the only person setting up cross profession combos, and when i did, no one would understand what to do with it. Arena Net only has two main arguments for why they went for a cool-down only restriction: 1) In gw1 they had multiple restrictions, and because of that, they struggled to balance the game. They want gw2 to be completely balanced (maybe future e-sports). 2) If a player wants to just spam skills, it is their loss, because those skills will be on cool-down when they actually need it.

gel wrote:
Dynamic events that aren't so dynamic and all they do is loop
Thin quest system
Archaic quest system disguised as a new system but is ultimately the same as most MMOs

Arena Net has stated that that they have 3 types of dynamic events. The first one is a looping one (like you are describing). The second one is a tug of war (where you push an event chain in one direction, or the other). The last one is called an event web (the dynamic events they glorify in their ads). They said that near the beginning of the game they only use looping and tug of war events, because they want to ease people in understanding how dynamic events work. Event webs, are more and more prevalent as you get closer to the end of the game. I'm not sure what you mean by a thin quest system, so ill just describe how i view questing in the game. I see quest as broken down into 3 types, Story, heart, and dynamic. The story quest resembles playing through a single player RPG (though you can bring friends along). Heart quest are traditional MMO quest where you just do as they say. Dynamic event quest are just the dynamic events. The only type of questing i dont like is the heart quest because they are exactly like traditional MMOs, but Arena Nest had said two things about them: 1) in Orr, the end game area, there will be no heart quests, just loads and loads of event webs. Whether that means only Orr will will have no heart quests or the game will have less and less heart quest through progression, i dont know. 2) they said is that heart quest are only there to drag players into dynamic event heavy zones, it sounds good, but in the beta, people went to the heart quest just to do the heart quest.

gel wrote:
everyone is 9 heads tall including children

You were probably a Norn


Last edited by Frozen Branch on Sun Jul 29, 2012 2:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 2:19 pm 
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By a "thin quest system" that is similar to other MMOs, I mean that you still have a bunch of enemies standing in a field, picking their noses, waiting for you to attack them. They actually pose no threat, even if that farmer is telling you they are destroying his crops or scaring the town people. They aren't. They just stand there in the field waiting for someone to attack them.

So I attack them, and what about the guys standing next to them? Perhaps now at least I've triggered a war and the others will join in? No, they still just stand around, and only the guy I attacked will fight me. Maybe if I accidentally hit a guy with an AoE he'll join in. So then for those quests, which is most quests I ran into, I purposely ran around attacking as many dudes as I could just to have a challenge. Attack 5 guys to have 5 guys attacking me instead of 1 or 2.

And why is this important?

Quote:
For example, in a traditional MMO, the character who gives you a quest will tell you ogres are coming to destroy the character's home, and you need to kill them. You then get a quest which says, "Kill 0/10 ogres" and you proceed to kill a bunch of ogres standing around in a field picking daisies. Since every player in the game needs to be able to do this quest, the ogres will never actually threaten the character's home - they will just eternally pick daisies in the field. The ogres aren't actually doing what the quest says they are - the game is lying to you!

At ArenaNet, we believe this is NOT good enough. In Guild Wars 2, if a character tells you ogres are coming to destroy a house, they will really come and smash down the house if you don't stop them!

source: http://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/d ... -overview/

THEY STILL DO THAT IN GUILD WARS 2. Their dynamic events system doesn't, but the rest of their quests still totally do exactly as they said other games do it and why it's bad. Gotta kill 0/10, standing in the field picking daisies, every player has to do these quests so they never pose an actual threat. So ArenaNet is lying to us still, as they said. But I'm sure they're aware of this.


The other part that makes it "thin" is that the game treats you as if you were the only person around. I see a heart icon (their replacement for the classic ! they said "other" games still use) above a farmer's head. What does the apple farmer say to me? "Oh gel, you need to kill 5 spiders to save my farm! Without you, I can't make my apple pie!" So I'm Farmer Leia's only hope. Except there are 30 other guys killing spiders in that same farm about 5 feet away from this farmer. It's impersonal and unbelievable, which is actually ironic seeing as how they call me by name or address me as the "hero" because they are trying to make me seem important and personalized. This isn't a problem in GW2 alone, but with their talk about changing up the MMO RPG formula, they really didn't try very hard.

As for target based gaming, it still is. You can't argue that it isn't because you still have to target enemies. It's like saying "I don't see TF2 as an FPS, it's more of a team-based strategy game." And yet, it's still a first person shooter. GW2 is still target based regardless of how you see it. It's how it was desgined and programmed. Sure, you have to sort of look at the enemy's general direction, but that isn't any form of aiming. So what is it? Super auto aim? Look anywhere near 90 degrees of their general direction and attacks will hit, and what is that dodge roll move? A cooldown based single ability that will increase your chance of randomly dodging an incoming attack. It's not even close to dodging.

TERA has more things pushing it forward, and even it is stuck in the old ways of everything, aside from some combat advances. Too bad they structured GW2 the way they did, because starting with looping events makes events feel hollow, and not a good way at all to introduce people to "dynamic events."

Also, I wasn't a Norn, but I was talking about everyone in town, saw all the races that were unlocked in the beta so far, and children really are just tiny adults (lazy reuse of the same animation rig). The humans have the same issue.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2012 3:38 pm 
Woodpecker
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Im not sure if you did that on purpose or not, but I like what u did there with the picking noses to picking daises. I also guess i never noticed the kids in the game. I've only played Charr, Sylvari and Norn. Charr adults and cubs are significantly different, Sylvari dont have children, and I havent ran into a Norn child.

Everything you are saying about the thin questing system is all the heart quest stuff, and i agree with you that it is exactly like the old quest system. In my opinion, they need to overhaul the heart quest part of the game or turn them into dynamic events. Saving my farm from spiders is better than killing 5 of 30. Id prefer a whole game to be sandbox of event webs, but i think A-net knows, and that is why they went out of their way to talk about Orr not having heart quests in the "Bringing the RPG to MMORPGs" video above. As for only getting attacked by 1-2 NPCs at a time, i guess i never noticed that too, but 100% sure it will get more challenging as we get into the higher levels.

For me, the difference between using a skill that will always hit and using a skill you have to aim with, is a big enough difference for me to see the combat system as a position game over a target based. Either ways, i still like both.

I cant find any videos on Tera, and Secret World that verbally explains the how they differentiate from other MMOs.


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 10:14 am 
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Played the Tera Beta, and if you are not actively facing your target your attacks will miss. There was no auto targeting and spamming of abilities, you HAD to manually target then attack, and stay facing your target. It IS a more active way to fight, however, the quests were...lacking...they were just like any other Korean made grind MMO. Go out, kill 10 xxx bring me back their xxx.


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 4:39 pm 
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I had a chance to play in the only dungeon available dungeon during the beta weekends. I PUG'd the dungeon and we didn't have much of a problem with it. There were some deaths as we figured out the dungeon. I found it easier to get in and get done than say WoW heroics. Though I'm sure that the "Explorable" versions of the dungeon are much harder though as they are supposed to be much more difficult.

I found that around level 30 when fighting regular mobs (not in the dungeon) your level it gets much more difficult and you need to run away if you aggro more than 2 mobs.

I think the heart missions are not very interesting but I like that it gives you a reason to go over to the area. Often the heart quests are the type of quest that gel describes. In Arena Net's defense I believe they were talking about their dynamic events when talking about the events not being like standard quest's. I have found that one of those static people from the heart quest's will often run up to you and ask you to help out in dynamic events. There's a little Norn ranch where you throw snowballs at the kids and every so often bears will raid the ranch. The cool part is if you look and follow the NPC's they actually move around and talk to eachother and those actions lead up to dynamic events. Here's a video showing that off. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=6CyqGJHTjes#t=134s

As you get higher level I noticed that the dodge button is something that you need to use sparingly. Mobs get tougher and require a bit strategy to take down. I didn't make a human in BW3 but I heard that they reduced the speed at which the dynamic events loop. They also added 2-3 more dynamic events in the human zone between BW1-2. They may have added more in BW3 I just didn't play there as I was busy messing with the two newly released races.

With a lot of classes I noticed that you need to pay attention to what your skills do or you will do much less dmg than you could be doing. For example if you are using a warrior you have a rifle skill its number 3 or 4 that causes vulnerability. If you use the vulnerability skill just before you use your number 2 skill which shoots a ton of shots in a short amount of time or your F1 skill you do significantly more damage.

I also saw something similar with the Necromancer and rods. The number 1 and 2 skills cause conditions on the enemy and the number 3 skills does extra damage for the amount of conditions you have on the enemy. I ended up taking a utility skill that added a ton of conditions on an enemy for a few seconds and if you time it right you can do a TON of damage with that number 3 skill. In WvW I was doing well over 1k dmg to enemies I would do that to. My damage was not that high because I was low level with bad equipment but it was much more damage than when I only had 2 conditions on them.

Arena Net said that they are going more the route of MOBA's as far as the skill system. I got really into League of Legends for a while and love how Arena Net removed the mana / energy limits and just added timers. I find that a lot of your skills are supposed to be used in certain situations and a smart player will use them when you need them like in the instances I explained above. This can mean life or death if everyone in your party is not playing smart.

I believe that there are still problems with GW2 but I also believe that its a really solid game. The one thing that I give to Arena Net is that they listen to their players. They added so many things that the players wanted between BW1 and BW3. I was truly amazed at how well they communicated with the player base.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:34 pm 
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I agree with a lot of what Earthacis and Gel are saying - I find that I fall somewhere between these two viewpoints. I'm a little let down that Arena Net didn't follow through with everything they promised, as I really wanted this one to be something new and unique, but at the same time, I won't be cancelling my pre-order or anything, it's got a lot going for it, and no subscription fee to boot, which is a nice bonus.

It's got some promise, and the exploration and vista quests really had me hooked during BW3. I haven't spent that much time jumping around trying to climb around on the terrain since Bael, Narish and I took the WoW guild into Mount Hyjal while it was still locked shut (man that was fun!).


Also, moving back toward the original topic -

Who's playing?

Me!

What profession/race/build, is your main?

Probably Norn Engineer, leatherworking and whatever that one that makes guns is.

What do you like/hate the most about the game?

Like - exploring the world and massive cities. Dislike - Arena Net not coming through on everything they alluded to.

Are we going to have an official guild?

I don't know, but I call not it in regards to who's running it. :D

WoW & TF2 has its own section on the forums. Is GW2 gunna have one?

If enough interest is generated, it'll definitely get its own section.

What sever to pick? (I want to WvWvW with the guild members).

I think the important thing here is that we pick one and stick to it. I tried to get on the same server as everyone when swtor launched, but by the time I realized we moved to a new one, I was max level and there was no way I was starting over.

With that said, I think it would be nice to play on the sanctum of rall server that Jinxter posted about over in this thread - viewtopic.php?f=21&t=14701


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:06 pm 
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My main will either be Mesmer / Human or Sylvari / Necromancer.

Like / Dislike: I like that the game seems really fluid in its combat which is what I'm focused on. I dislike that we only get 5 character slots to start.

I don't know what server I'm gonna be on but it needs to bee a server heavily based on WvW as thats one of my main interests in the game.

Here's hoping they add a Team Based Death match like RA in GW1.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 8:53 pm 
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Frozen Branch wrote:
GW2 comes out on AUGUST 28. As the game closer to its release, I think we should talk more about forming a guild (i have no power to make it official).

So I have a few questions that I would like answered:

Who's playing?
What profession/race/build, is your main?
What do you like/hate the most about the game?
Are we going to have an official guild?
WoW & TF2 has its own section on the forums. Is GW2 gunna have one?
What sever to pick? (I want to WvWvW with the guild members).


My primary will most likely be a Human or Norn Guardian.


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 7:32 pm 
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To follow up and reply on a few things:
Sure, we can have an official RH guild. Whoever is playing from the community can work towards organizing something. Officers and Guild honcho would be chosen through some reasonably fair process TBD.
Section on the forums would be entertained if there is enough forum activity to warrant it. Let's see how it plays out.
I plan on playing but keep missing the events. :doh:

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 2:33 am 
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Cool-cool-cool, sounds like good progress for a GW2 community. Btw They will conducting a stress test on Thursday, August 2 from 12:00 Noon PACIFIC Time to 4:00 PM PACIFIC Time, if you happen to read this and have time between then. It's about 9.5 hours from when im posting this.


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 7:35 pm 
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Since they delete people's characters in beta what server are we going to end up on because the one we choose isn't on the list anymore

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2012 12:55 am 
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The best part is we don't actually have to be on the same server unless we plan on doing PvP together. I'll likely be on Crystal Desert.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:05 pm 
Woodpecker
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Server Dragonbrand


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 12:46 pm 
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Both Dragonbrand and Crystal Desert are full, will not let me select either one.

I will choose Borliss Pass.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 3:04 pm 
Woodpecker
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the 1st whole week, everyone is allowed to switch servers freely


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 6:49 pm 
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Everything was full, so I also jumped onto Borliss Pass

Post up your character names if you haven't already - mine is Holy Toe Leto.


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 4:01 pm 
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Are we coordinating a Home World? I really don't like that AreaNet is forcing us to select one, but if we are going to play together then we should coordinate one.
I just reloaded the game. (Forgot how freaking big it is) I guess everything I had done previously is gone. Now what?


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 4:49 pm 
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As said above, everyone went Dragonbrand, but that filled up, so everyone else went onto Borliss Pass. I really wanted Yak's Bend, but no one here was on that. Such a funny name.

It's ok that you aren't on the same server if you're playing PvE. PvP 9and WvW) is where you'll want to be on the same server. PvE can just join each other no matter which server you're on.

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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 5:26 pm 
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If you guys are going to to ANY PVP, then consider going to a different server...one where you can ALL play together/win together. You might even see me somewhere...all of the new news and vids is twisting it's way into my blackened soul...


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 Post subject: Re: Guild Wars 2 Guild?
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2012 7:05 pm 
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Server transfers are still free this first week. We could ask everyone to move to another lower population server. Only takes a few minutes to do a server transfer.

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